Tag Archives: banter

Blog Banter: The Capsuleer Experience

Blog Banter 33: The Capsuleer Experience

Like mana from Valhalla (yes I know I'm mixing my religious metaphors), the latest Dev Blog by CCP Legion asks questions which make for perfect Blog Bantering. To quote him "...we want to make the first days, weeks and months in EVE enjoyable and not just something ‘you have to plough through in order to get to the good stuff’" and the newly formed Player Experience team will focus on "...where and why people lose interest in EVE...".

"We invite you to pour your heart (or guts) out and tell us what you think is good or bad with the current new player experience and what you think could be done about the problems."

So let's get self-eviscerating. Banter on.


Mat "Freebooted" Westhorpe

I have to say – when I first read this banter, I thought, “Capsuleer? God, I fucking miss that app.” Sure, we are talking about the newbie experience here, but does anyone else miss that thing? Anyway.

The new player experience is certainly something that needs to be improved. Many games have tried this; EQ2 with the “island” you get stuck on for a while and other games with friendly “zones”, etc. World of Warcraft does this by having mountains surrounding everything; essentially the same. Eve does not need that type of new player experience. I think what Eve needs is a more interactive “community” in the first space station you are spawned to.

What I mean by this is that getting a bunch of tutorial windows popping up is sometimes confusing. A story-line would be helpful, as to why you are here, where you came from, etc. An understanding that you are on your own is nice, too. How about the freedom to, within the first month, recycle all of your skill points?

Knowing full well that it is “dangerous out there” is one thing. It is another to be mining for the first time, like an idiot, in your first Iteron and a jetcan or three. How can we fix that? I don’t know. Is it broken? Part of me doesn’t think so. When I started playing, I didn’t jetcan because I paid attention to the game. Maybe that’s really it: Eve is hard to pay attention to when you are new.

Other Banters:

Know what would have been nice with the “new website”, CCP?

A mobile friendly version of EVE Gate. http://gate.eveonline.com while on my iPhone can be viewed, but application of a different CSS sheet isn’t too bad. I know, it’s so 2005 to apply different logic to a site based upon screen size, but hey, who am I? I’m just a developer. Nothing much.

Banter #26: Beauty is in the eye of the markets

Welcome to the twenty-sixth installment of the EVE Blog Banter, the monthly EVE Online blogging extravaganza created by CrazyKinux. The EVE Blog Banter involves an enthusiastic group of gaming bloggers, a common topic within the realm of EVE Online, and a week or so to post articles pertaining to the said topic. The resulting articles can either be short or quite extensive, either funny or dead serious, but are always a great fun to read! Any questions about the EVE Blog Banter should be directed to crazykinux@gmail.com. Check for other EVE Blog Banter articles at the bottom of this post!

This month’s topic was proposed by @KatiaSae of the much praised “To Boldly Go” blog. Katia asks: “Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. As an astrophotographer, I’ve found it in the stars and planets of New Eden. Where have you found it? Perhaps you’ve found beauty in the ships we fly? Maybe it’s the sight of profits being added to your bottom line? Or maybe it’s the pilot portraits you see in the comm channels? Where ever you’ve found it, write about it and post an image.” Don’t be afraid go beyond the simple visual aspects of EVE as well. Is the EVE Community in itself a thing of beauty? What makes EVE the game, the world, the Community, so appealing to you?

The original title mentioned something about holding beers.  I should start by saying that most nights, when I play EVE, I’m not drinking.  Then again, I don’t get drunk.  I just couldn’t think of a better title at the moment.  Suddenly Ninjas does encourage turning EVE into a drinking game as often as possible, but the only beauty in that is that our voice comms quickly turn into a penis joke channel.  To each their own.  I am in no means complaining.

Back on track.  What is beautiful in EVE?  When I first started this game, I thought, “Holy hell.  Space.  It’s big.  But…”

“All the systems look alike. It’s just planets.”

“Space is always black.  It’s not EVE or even Everquest 1.”

Then I started to play.  I mean, actually play.  The fact that is that space isn’t always black, and all the systems certainly do not look alike.  You begin to “own” your region you call home. [EVE Travel is one of my favorite EVE related sites, by the way.  All should check that out.]  I feel out of place or like I’m on an extended vacation when I hop into the ninja-orca and run off to another area with the intent of stealing from the locals.

Back onto the idea of what is beautiful.

That is beauty.  A PLEX for 400k.  From my neck of the woods, money in real life can sometimes be tight due to some medical concerns.  That’s not why I place those contracts however.  If money is tight, I’ll just not play.  Simple.

But that you can take an existing arena called the contract/marketplace and apply social engineering, dumb luck, and a little bit of P.T. Barnum-esque skills to the mix – makes the game we all love to play so very interesting to me.

Sure, I fly around, steal loot and try to get into fights.  But where I really, truly, enjoy EVE is in the non-visual side of the game.  The beauty behind playing a character, infiltrating a corporation, and then fleecing them.  Gaining trust as if it were a failing form of currency; that the mint does not realize is failing.

Getting people to misclick and sell a PLEX for 400k, a full thousand times lower than market value is easy.  It’s only happened once, but it’s easy nonetheless.  What takes true beauty is gaining entry into a corporation, or something else we at Suddenly Ninjas and TEARS do often:

Determine and discover game mechanics that piss people off, make us rich, and put our corporation and its alliance on the map.  While my schedule doesn’t allow for much corp-op stuff, that we do it makes me very proud.

They are usually held secret, until either a mechanic is nerfed or we move on to the next thing because the public has adjusted.  That constant take-give-take more is what keeps me playing.

Be certain: there is a level of beauty to this game that is not visual.  It’s spreadsheets, social science, and firepower.

I’m sure this appeal to me is partly because I am by career a programmer, and firefighter.  I’m into discovering new methods do to the “same old thing” and very happy when shit hits the fan and my heart starts to race a bit!

Here are some of the other sites talking about Banter #26:

Agral and a Dod Run

Moved the orca back to Agral tonight, and snagged a lot of loot from a couple mission runners.  One was in a nice Dominix Navy Issue, and never shot at me.  His T2 drones would have had me out cold, in no time flat.  Too bad, for him, because I don’t have anything to solo that ship with and there were no corp members nearby tonight.  (Plus, I didn’t feel like getting on voice ops.)

That said, I’m seriously just stealing and then worrying about getting shot at later.  I have to think that my ROI will be much higher.  Especially the ROI on tears as well as ISKies.

Didn’t do this Blog Banter, I just wan’t feeling it, so to speak.  Here are a list of the participants, however.

  1. CrazyKinux’s Musing: EVE Blog Banter #25: And by Alliance you mean…..?
  2. BB25 What sov changes will come? | A Mule In EvE
  3. Confessions of a Closet Carebear: Alliances and Sovereignty
  4. Blog Banter 25: Nerfing Nulsec « OMG! You’re a Chick?!
  5. Have Alliances and the sovereignty system limited the amount of PVP and RP potential in Null sec? | Nitpickin’s
  6. Blog Banter #25: Alliance and Sovereignty Limiting PvP in 0.0? | Sarnel Binora’s Blog
  7. Blog Banter #25 – Mad Haberdashers
  8. Alliances and sovereignty | Eve Online Focus
  9. …Shall we not Revenge?: BB 25: What if the Alliance vanished?
  10. Blog Banter: Alliances and Sov
  11. EVEOGANDA: BB25: Sov ‘n Go!
  12. » TBG:EBB#25 – Alliances and Sovereignty To Boldly Go
  13. Freebooted: BB25: Leviathans of the Deep
  14. Wrong Game Tetra ~ Inner Sanctum of the Ninveah
  15. EVE Blog Banter #25 – Human nature what art thou? | Way of the Gun
  16. Who cares about Sov? – Hands Off, My Loots! ~ well sorta like an entry! :p
  17. The 25th EVE Blog Banter: Alliances and sovereignty – The Phoenix Diaries
  18. Achernar: The space commute
  19. Wandering the Void…my EvE musings. – Blog Banter: Alliances and sovereignty
  20. (OOC) CK’s Blog Banter #25: How To Break EvE. « Prano’s Journey
  21. Captain Serenity: Blog Banter #25 – Crappy mechanics
  22. Helicity Boson » Blog Banter #25 Nullsec and sov.
  23. BB #25 – “With whom lie the advantages derived from Heaven and Earth?”
  24. Boom! Hull-Shot?: It’s the End of the Eve as We Know It
  25. sered’s lives: EVE Blog Banter #25 – Size does matter
  26. 25th EVE BB – Medieval Solutions to Spaceship Problems | Inventions of a New Eden Industrialist
  27. Eve Blog Banter #25: “Have Alliances and Sov Limited PvP and RP in 0.0?” « Align Outbound



Blog Banter 22: Corp (dis)loyalty

Welcome to the twenty-second installment of the EVE Blog Banter, the monthly EVE Online blogging extravaganza created by CrazyKinux. The EVE Blog Banter involves an enthusiastic group of gaming bloggers, a common topic within the realm of EVE Online, and a week or so to post articles pertaining to the said topic. The resulting articles can either be short or quite extensive, either funny or dead serious, but are always a great fun to read! Any questions about the EVE Blog Banter should be directed to crazykinux@gmail.com. Check for other EVE Blog Banter articles at the bottom of this post!

This month topic is brought to us by L’Dene Bean of Nitpickin’s who asks: Why, and how did you pick your corporation? Is your loyalty solid or just until a better placed organization “recruits” you. The shorter version:  Who holds your Unshakable Fealty and why?

The title of this banter post has the whole “dis” option on the loyalty for a specific reason.  Firstly – loyalty in general, especially in EVE, comes basically at an exchange of one thing for another (being: the membership).

Safety, production, friendship (both IRL and in game), and sometimes even nefarious reasons.

I started EVE within a small corporation; that eventually disbanded.  This was not with Gilbert, but another character.  I moved that character into my own corporation with the intent of picking up some business salvaging and doing small-scale pirate like things.  Pretty small.

When I rerolled and came up with Gilbert Hamilton, I joined Suddenly Ninjas almost right away.  I’ve loved it ever since.  My loyalty is not just to SN, but to the alliance; I’ve found having that foundation has made EVE very much something I look forward to playing.  There are no real politics, and people are just “there”.  No taxes, no worry about being on to guard a POS, etc.  If you want to do something, you do it.  If not, so what.  That means a lot to me, with family and all that in the real world.

With my first character, I realized I could incorporate him into the SN mindset, but without joining SN directly.  I created a 3rd character to act as CEO of my corporation. (I like the name and wanted to keep it.)

My first character then went back to the contacts that were in his first corporation and joined one of the children corps.  You know what happened with that, and can see a post about it here.  He has since left that corporation under the excuse of internal strife from the theft.

This is the other half of loyalty.  It’s generally considered “social engineering” and it’s something that I can, when my mind is put to it, be good at.  The corporation I joined after the one I fleeced, was another spawn of the first corporation.  They do not talk to each other and I was given instant acceptance without an API check.

My loyalty with all of my characters is with SN/TEARS – and anything I fleece from this corporation will be available to SN/TEARS members at a low low price of zero to nothing, where needed.

Here are some other posts about this blog-banter in the EVE community:

Low Sec = No Sec

Welcome to the twenty-first installment of the EVE Blog Banter, the monthly EVE Online blogging extravaganza created by CrazyKinux. The EVE Blog Banter involves an enthusiastic group of gaming bloggers, a common topic within the realm of EVE Online, and a week to post articles pertaining to the said topic. The resulting articles can either be short or quite extensive, either funny or dead serious, but are always a great fun to read! Any questions about the EVE Blog Banter should be directed to crazykinux@gmail.com. Check for other EVE Blog Banter articles at the bottom of this post!

This month’s topic comes to us from @ZoneGhost who a few month ago asked “Is Low Sec the forgotten part of EVE Online?” Is it? I’d like us to explore this even further. Is Low Sec being treated differently by CCP Games than Null Sec (Zero-Zero) or Empire space is? Can one successfully make a living in these unsecured systems where neither Alliance nor Concord roam to enforce their laws? What’s needed? Or is everything fine as it is?

I titled my post “Low Sec = No Sec” because of the way I play.  I’ll explain that in a minute; first a bit of history about my play styles.

I started EVE not knowing a thing.  Queue that XKCD image with a nasty learning curve.  It really wasn’t that bad, I came from EQ1 beta “wtf do I do now?” days.  Hell, I was happy it wasn’t as linear as World of Warcraft, to be honest.  I joined a mining corporation that hung out in the Everyshore region.  Then, low-sec looked like a place where the ore may be better (and sometimes  existed only there) but there were “bad guys” there.  The police still responded, but slower; I thought that mattered.

I lost a few ships right away to some curiosity about gates, guns, low-sec   movement, etc.  Hell, I never realized the D-Scan was good for anything.

Today, I play as an annoying high-sec pirate.  With a new character.  I make my money off of your hard work.  (Thus the name of this blog: “Diary of a Garbageman.” – if you cleaned up your stuff I’d be broke.) To me, there is no difference between low-sec and high-sec.  I just find killing people in high-sec to be harder.  Not that I get many kills to begin with, I enjoy very much the social engineering that is required to go into a high-sec kill.

That said, I’m currently working an alt in a wormhole.  That’s totally different, and to be honest, I don’t know that I like it too much.

In terms of the actual question in the banter: I don’t think CCP gives any more or less attention to the different security status levels of the systems/regions.  I have always seen the 3D map showing sec status as a bit of a ‘we started here and the rest, there be dragons’ kind of thing.  It would be cool if sec status _changed_ over time, for instance.  Maybe with NPC border skirmishes, helped by the players, too.  Almost like the Sansha invasions, possibly.

In short, I don’t feel there is any real difference between low-sec and other sec levels, nor do I feel CCP has done anything wrong, etc.  I look forward to exploring more of the lower-sec space, but to be honest, it will be with the sole intent of finding new and surprising ways to piss people off and take their money.

Here are a few other links within this current Blog Banter:

  1. CrazyKinux’s Musing: The Lure of the Wild
  2. Subs’ suds: Forever a noob in Eve: Low-Sec – the forgotten part of EVE Online
  3. Blog Banter XXI – Lo-sec = Low Priority? | I am Keith Neilson
  4. where the frack is my ship?: Blog Banter 21: What’s good for the goose…
  5. Blog Banter #21: Change? | Sarnel Binora’s Blog
  6. Friggin Low Sec
  7. Low Sec = Wild West
  8. In The Ghetto
  9. Banter 21: Low-Sec
  10. Arr, Yer be talkin’ bout me lowsec
  11. Low Sec: I wanna talk to you
  12. Fish Heads and Baby Ruths
  13. Change?

Grinding. Teeth? EVE? Both?

Does EVE have a grind?” is the title of the latest question over at Ecliptic Rift.  I like that post, a lot.  Because it sums up just about everything I enjoy about EVE compared to other games.  Especially compared to World of Warcraft. (Something four of my family members play, near daily.)

I quickly realized that most MMO games are all grind-xp-ding-grind-repeat games and first remember recognizing this when I was hunting down the Journeyman’s Boots in Everquest 1.  Those damn things pissed me off.  I still kept playing, but I distinctly remember switching to the “no-rules” pvp server and I quickly enjoyed the game again.  (I had an enchanter, would make myself look like a coin or dagger (ie small) and then go around firebombing all I could.)

Grinding in EVE is different, it is by choice.  In that, nearly the instant you finish gelling together as your first “clone” – you can do nothing, everything, or nearly everything.  The closest I’ve come to grinding in EVE is by doing one of the first epic mission arcs; something for the Sisters, I do believe.  I realized that I could grind more if I wanted to spend cash and loyalty points for phat-lewtz.

Instead I went pseudo pirate (hi-sec) and then joined a corporation.  In that corporation, we have someone who is already high on the LP side of things, and that is what that person enjoys doing, so I buy things from the LP store through them.  Done.

I would also posit that the lack of a “forced” grind in some aspects is also a pain for the newer EVE players.  They are used to seeing something do “ding” and yes, skill queues and certificates do that, but I remember early on in this blog I had one problem:  planning what I was going to do next.  With so much to do, where do I start?  One of the biggest links on my “tag cloud” is of course, “Planning“.

This is where the community comes in.  Largely in part to the link gathering of one Crazy Kinux, and the other blogs, too.  Reading other blogs helped me to understand what others did, when they did it, and how they did it.

I still think that having some form of “geek EVE code” and/or achievement/badging system would be cool – if only external.   It is an idea I’m toying around with, API wise, and imagination wise.  If someone were missing the “grind” they could always tinker with that.  ie:  a badge for killing every other frigate with a navitas, etc.

Griefing… a Blog Banter

Welcome to the twentieth installment of the EVE Blog Banter, the monthly EVE Online blogging extravaganza created by CrazyKinux. The EVE Blog Banter involves an enthusiastic group of gaming bloggers, a common topic within the realm of EVE Online, and a week to post articles pertaining to the said topic. The resulting articles can either be short or quite extensive, either funny or dead serious, but are always a great fun to read! Any questions about the EVE Blog Banter should be directed to crazykinux@gmail.com. Check out other EVE Blog Banter articles at the bottom of this post!

With the recent completion of the 3rd installment of the Hulkageddon last month, @CyberinEVE, author of Hands Off, My Loots!, asks: “Griefing is a very big part of EVE. Ninja Salvaging, Suicide Ganking, Trolling, and Scamming are all a very large part of the game. What do you think about all these things? You can talk about one, or all…but just let us know your overall opinion on Griefing, and any recommendations you may have to change it if you think it’s needed.”

Well to be honest – I am a bit biased.  I make 90% of my ISK and enjoyment (and therefore utility) out of what I can gather from others.  I shall start, however, with something I don’t consider part of my usual toolbox: griefing.

Griefing, in my opinion, is causing concern, harm, or frustration to another player without their ability to stop that from happening.  eg: in Everquest 1 days, griefing may have been sitting a large character in a small doorway, trapping the player in a little hut outside of Rivervale.  Then leaving your PC on and logged in for hours.  I won’t do those types of things, unless they are in response to actions from the mark or player attacking me.

That said, on to the next item in the list: Ninja Salvaging.  I use that tactic for my income and it helps support my habit of losing ships in what I call “learning PVP” battles.  (Read: I suck at PVP.)  I also use ninja salvaging as part of a bag of tricks to get a mission runner to attack me, in hopes I can “learn more” by returning with a bigger ship.  This is not griefing, because no where does the mission runner have to attack me, nor am I stopping them from completing an objective using a game tactic that is against the “rules.”

I’ve used Suicide Ganking as a method of pissing off someone before, or just to see if I could do it.  To me, it’s a valid tactic, but a bit on the “aww, come on, really?” scale – if used for just boredom or pissing people off.  In battle (especially in battle not involving a wardec), it is acceptable.

I use the term battle here to include suicide ganking as a reasonable response to a jerk acting up in local, etc.

One of the things I love about EVE and one of the reasons I keep playing is that the conversations in local and in corp chat are very much “older” – there are kids playing, but not usually.  This isn’t WoW and attention spans are shorter with those guys.  In Dodixie, you can get into some nice socially engineered conversations and end up scamming someone, or watching the other scammers double your isk, sell contracts, and fleet-warp people.  Those things are there, and I acknowledge them, however I only pull those tools out when I am really bored.  Rarely.

Can flipping and miner bumping are two favorites of mine.  I use miner bumping as a chance to practice keeping transversal high, and when when that gets boring, I go straight into the miner, pushing him away from his ore.  Rarely do they bitch, and never do they shoot.    Most of the miners these days are afk anyway.

Other Banters

As always…

Roc’s opinion of the latest Blog Banter solves not only the women issue, but most other issues in game too. Great job! ;)

Blog Banter: The Ladies

CrazyKinux asks: What could CCP Games do to attract and maintain a higher percentage of women to the game. Will Incarna do the trick? Can anything else be done in the mean time? Can we the players do our part to share the game we love with our counterparts, with our sisters or daughters, with the Ladies in our lives? What could be added to the game to make it more attractive to them? Should anything be changed? Is the game at fault, or its player base to blame?

I’ve been playing EVE for a few months now.  On a regular basis since roughly November of 2009.  I know one of the things I enjoy about the game, others may not enjoy.  That is, of course, gathering tears and banter via the method of salvage that tends to annoy the most.  Ninja Salvage, to be specific.

That said, I am still very much learning the details of this game; something I don’t expect will ever end.  I’ve noticed very few female players.  Rather, I’ve noticed a lot of female characters, but hold it unlikely that many, if any, are female on the other side of the intertubes.

My wife plays WOW and comes from the good old Everquest-1 days.  I played EQ1, as well.  In fact, we played at the same time, just didn’t know each other “back then.”  One of the things she’s always said she enjoys is character maintenance and healing others.

In talking about how much character maintenance there is within EVE, I think I’ve struck up some interest in her for the game.  Mentioning, “it’s like spreadsheets on crack,” is a good thing to say to an accountant/auditor.

A few more ideas come to mind on how females could be attracted to the game:

  • A focus on “career paths” that last through/past the tutorial.  Do you want to be a “healer”, to focus on remote repair of ships and structures?  Do you like that “sit on the sides, ensuring all is taken care of” aspect of groups in other games?  A path sort of like a “chief mechanic” would be interesting.  More specifically, a method for your position along the paths to be known would be nice.  I’m not speaking about “levels” but goals.  Women like goals and shopping lists.  Hell, I do, too.  So if you know you would like Core Comp @ standard, Armor Taking @ standard, and Remote Repair @ above standard – it would be nice to keep a “log” of how far along those are and what ones you are working toward.  That isn’t the notepad.  All I’ve ever used that thing for is AU conversions.
  • Acknowledgment that the people playing tend to be more mature. (I say this as I try my best to bring the immature tears out of people…)  Face it, EVE has a learning curve that we all love.  I think that curve helps keep the “kids” out of our space, and keep the adults there.  Which, of course, makes for more pleasant conversation.  Less “omg cybar?” and more “oh my god, care to have internet sex with me?”  See, the conversation is more adult already. ;)  In all seriousness, I think the community of New Eden is fantastic and the best I’ve seen since the “beta” days of EQ1 where people had to work together, or die trying not to.

That about sums up my thoughts.   They are simple and, I think, largely repeated throughout our Space.    People love the community, love the details, love the geek factors, and love the maintenance factors of EVE.  We’re not playing for levels, xp, “shineys”, or things like that.  We are playing to have fun.  A focus that is often forgotten in the other games as you work through the hell-levels.

A few other blog-banter posts are out there already, and I think they are wonderful reads:  EVE Trial By Fire has a great writeup. Ombey, too. (however I can’t “proof” the post at work, I read it at home.) Arukemos likes girls. Mandrill, as always, has a great point of view.  Michael Williams looks at the other games out there and some casual improvements are mentioned.  An Zajamaru has a great opinion here, too.